Interview - DJ Ikonika - Dubstep, Drums & Other Discoveries.

11th June, 2008.

A lazy weekday afternoon for me generally constitutes spending as much time as I care to spend doing very little; usually to wind down after an early shift at work.
Thankfully, today was different; I was lucky enough to spend a couple of hours shooting the breeze with the critically-lauded DJ Ikonika of the ever-expanding London Dubstep scene. I tentatively asked her if she would be a subject for an interview to help me expand my portfolio and she kindly agreed, even bringing along some records to play.

Rather than go on about superficial data such as turn-ons/offs and favorite ice cream flavours, I decided it would be more worthwhile for my interests and any potential readers if I was to pick her brain from a musical standpoint.

Ikonika (nee Sara Abdel-Hamid) tells me this is a welcome change after being asked several broad questions about her leading some sort of female revolution in the world of dubstep and how sexism affects her making a breakthrough; questions which frankly, are too vague to be answered on a personal level.
So, after welcoming her into my home, making sure the minidisc was prepared for recording and some idle chat, I hit record and began with the questions...

Q: So, when did you first start producing & how did it happen? What influenced the decision?

Ikonika: It started sometime in 2004, wanting to make hip-hop like J Dilla & RnB 'bangers' like Amerie's producer; Rich Harrison. That was the original plan, but then I heard a Skream mix & was totally in love with the sound, so I set about figuring out what was happening musically & tried to emulate it with my own production.
As soon as I found out that London was also the birthplace of Dubstep, I was hugely motivated to pursue it because I knew I would be representing where I live with the music.

Q: Ok, So how did that branch out into becoming a DJ too? Because that is how you got your name out there, by playing to skeptical crowds who didn't think a girl could rock it at a dubstep night.

Ikonika: Well, when I was into making hip-hop beats I also wanted to learn how to DJ and scratch, I even got the Q-Bert instructional DVD!
But once my focus transferred to dubstep, it was only natural to start DJ'ing that, plus; its a different kind of buzz to producing, and I enjoy both.

Q: And as far as being on Hyperdub, I believe the story of that is surprisingly straightforward..?

Ikonika: In a way, yeah. I made some tracks and sent them to Kode 9, and he gave me some good constructive feedback; like paragraphs of it! but basically said he wasn't feeling them. So, I made some more tracks shortly after that and sent them to him again, and he picked out 'Please' and said he wanted to release it. That was what got the whole thing moving, now the second single is coming out and Im getting to play shows in Berlin and Paris! It's a lot of fun. (Smiles contently)

Q: Aaaaand more power to you for it! Now, dubstep is not the easiest scene to be a legit part of, it seems to have a pretty strict code of conduct & very critical listeners, am I right?

Ikonika: Yeah, the dubstep code is similar to the hip-hop code; you have to pay your dues & earn respect; and obviously be good at it!

Q: Of course! What would you say are some of the rules of the dubstep "way"?

Ikonika: Well, if you produce dubstep, then you are going to have to play out to get your material heard and build your rep as a skillful DJ. The other "rules" so to speak, are that you only mix with vinyl and you cut your own dubplates.
Its not like a set formula, but pretty much everyone in the scene does this. The logic behind it is pretty obvious if you take a moment to think about it: Cutting your own dub's keeps vinyl pressing houses in business in this digital age where physical forms of music are disappearing. Its a win-win situation because they get business and you get your dubs cut, both parties get something they need out of it. The best example of this is Mala; to hear his new tunes, you have to go out and see him cause you wont find his stuff on the internet, he is the only one with a dub plate of it!
(thinks for a moment)
There are musical guidelines too, I mean, most of the melodies are created using synths, supplemented with effects, filters and other means of affecting the various textures in the music.
One of the things it shares with hip-hop is that it uses a lot of sampled drum sounds, giving it an organic side to go with the electronic methods of producing.

Q: Yeah, that was one of the things I always pinpointed and the thing I perhaps enjoyed most about dubstep is when the ethic of hip-hop and dubstep are combined to make music like....Joker; for example. That "Snake Eater" tune is ridiculous!
So, just to backpedal for a moment, because I think its necessary to bring to people's attention your musical background prior to production, could you just run through that quickly?


Ikonika: Yeah sure, I started out playing the drums at the age of 11, listening to hardcore and grunge music playing in a couple of bands with female friends...That part of me is still there, its just taken a backseat since turning my hand to dubstep, but my favorite band still, to this day, is Glassjaw.
I like to think that I apply the post-hardcore methods of songwriting to my production though, particularly Glassjaw's style of harsh verses coupled with melodic, pretty choruses. (NB: This can be heard in Ikonika's latest release, "Millie", where the bass during the verse is distorted almost to the point of being unpleasant; but then tied to a well-phrased and catchy chorus)

Q: Ok, Now, I know this just because I know you, but I have to say you a rarity among producers, because you don't like most "old" music!! And a lot of what we make these days is derived from various kinds of "old" music; so how come you don't like most of it?

Ikonika: Well, my parents never really exposed me to what they liked so I got a lot of my early taste from my sisters...So I like 80's Madonna and 90's Hip-Hop & RnB, you know?

Q: Sort of...go on...

Ikonika: There are times when I feel bad for not liking older music, because it is important to appreciate what came before; but I suppose it didn't really occur to me while I was listening to the Deftones!

Q: So do you like this (Burning Spear's "Ghost of Garvey" album plays in the background)?

Ikonika: (Straightfaced) Its alright...(awkward silence) hahahahah! Im not a bad person!

Q: Riiiiight... fair enough. Is it safe to assume that your previous musical experience of writing songs within a band context was helpful once it came to producing?

Ikonika: Yeah, it was, even though its a totally different animal you are dealing with when its just you and your computer software and hardware...For instance, I feel like I have a problem with the mid-range frequencies; and that's a big part of dubstep music, its not just having an LFO make wobble patterns, that's not enough to qualify something as "dubstep". For me, its about being able to get a clarity in your mid to high ranges while retaining the power in the sub-bass.

Q: I couldn't agree more, which is one of the reasons dubstep is best appreciated in a loud club, to fully enjoy the sub-frequencies, with the bass grabbing you by the chest so that you can't breathe!

Ikonika: Yep; that's a good example...

Q: Yes...So, into a more serious segment of the interview now, its your chance to piss people off with your opinion! Damn, sarcasm is hard to put across in writing... So, serious question number one, when did Dubstep officially begin?

Ikonika: Hah! It divides opinion...I jumped on it at the end of 2005, when there was a shift from the 2 step rhythm to the half time feel. Some people argue that it began with dark Garage, like Horsepower; some people feel it was a natural evolution from Grime.

Q: So where do you stand?

Ikonika: Having listened to Horsepower I can see why people would feel that it may have been the birth of dubstep, but I side more with the argument that it developed from Grime; and although I got into the "Run The Road" comps, I generally don't care for Grime music...

Q: Aha...How come?

Ikonika: Its the tinny, shrill sound most of it has, I know that comes from raw mixdowns, but I think its closer to being a shit mix than just being "raw", with all the poorly-mixed higher frequencies making most of it difficult to listen to, and not enough emphasis on the bass side of things.

Q: I see what you mean... so how do you feel about MC's in dubstep then? Because that seems to be something a lot of dubstep shares with grime; the MC running his mouth over everything...

Ikonika: With some dubstep it sounds real good, like when The Bug got Flow Dan from Roll Deep (a Grime MC from a Grime crew) to do really over-the-top violent lyrics. To the uninitiated, that will sound like those dudes take themselves really seriously, but in reality they were having fun with it....I don't know, theres not a set type of beat that will suit an MC, if it sounds good it sounds good; its hard to tell unless you have a version with and without an MC to compare side by side.

Q: So how about the longevity in dubstep, we saw garage and jungle suffer at the hands of Father Time, is there a danger that dubstep will become so underground and reject the mainstream to a point of eating itself up?

Ikonika: (Pauses) Its hard, because you want the scene to remain in the circle it already exists in, you get worried about more and more people getting into that circle and fucking things up. I think its natural to worry about that kind of thing happening though, its how most music ends up getting watered down.

Q: Precisely, I feel like my beloved psychedelic rock was ruined by a flock of "sheeple" looking to jump on the latest bandwagon to roll through town & not actually understand what it was about, just pre-occupied with getting high and portraying the stereotypical 'hippie' figure.

Ikonika: Yeah, exactly, so its difficult to say, you want it to prosper but not to get ruined, and striking that balance is hard. Its probably too early to tell, but people should focus on the positive aspects like Rinse FM and Brainfeeder Radio and see the growth; and the potential for further growth.

Q: Yes, its unfortunate that there is always a number of people who are waiting to see something fail so that they can gloat... So, what do you personally want out of dubstep?

Ikonika: To keep producing, to keep DJ'ing....If I could DJ 3 or 4 nights a week, every week for however many years to come; covering all my costs and expenses, I would be more than happy.
I don't really care for being like, Kanye West big, 'cause there is too much bullshit that comes with being in the spotlight that much.
When I look at Kode 9 and I see his schedule, its inspiring: he lectures on Sound Design one day a week, and then spends the rest of his time DJ'ing and producing.

Q: Kode 9 lecturing on Sound Design...seems very appropriate!

Ikonika: Yeah, he has also written a book about it called 'Sonic Warfare', but a lot of the material in it is over my head at the moment...He is a geek, but not in a geeky way at all, he just knows his shit.

Q: Speaking of geeks, how do you feel about producers who try sometimes to put too many different elements into their music and end up sacrificing the musicality?

Ikonika: Experimentation is great, it shows creativity, but ultimately its still gotta result in music....

Q:...Because its an art more than a science...

Ikonika: Exactly, for example, I would never make any beats that weren't quantized because it would make it harder for DJ's playing it out to mix with it. But that's partly because Im into structures and A and B sections, choruses...that's just me.
However, I do really like some of the busier stuff with multiple rhythms and mad, squelching noises; because when it comes out right it sounds amazing. Otherwise, it just sounds like a mess...

Q: But would you agree that the fact there are people trying to push the boundaries can only help the development of the genre?

Ikonika: Yeah, for the most part, I mean if you look at dubstep now and at dubstep when it started, already there have been various mutations, from the half-step feel to the obsession of wobble-basses to the more off-kilter feel thats popular now. Even with some techno styles being used, straight up 4/4 feels in beats as well. Im an advocate of advancement, you know? Progression. So, I like it that things move forward, its good.

Q: Yes, moving forward is how to come up with new ideas, but It doesnt hurt to look into the past to see how people went about it! So, what's most important to you in terms of DJ'ing?

Ikonika: Well, for when Im DJ'ing, to make the set interesting, I try to think what I would want from a DJ if I was a spectator. I like mixing long blends, trying to make various parts of tunes sound different, to make it exciting; as opposed to just playing track after track.

Q: I like that, the most interesting type of DJ is the one who uses all the parameters of their mixer to try and change the way that music feels and comes across to the audience.

Ikonika: Exactly, otherwise, why am I gonna go see that DJ, you know? I could just sit in my bedroom and play those records in that order.

Q: Damn straight. Now, from this new single, is it fair to say that I can see why you are being associated with this "wonky" tag?

Ikonika: Oh god...Like that isn't getting annoying already... I guess I can see it, but I don't understand it, my music has always been made with the intention of being really straight. If you listen to the drums and the bass in 'Please', they are straight! Because the melody line is jilted, people choose to focus on that and tag it as "wonky".
Everyone on the Hyperdub roster is tagged as being "wonky" though, its just people who are hearing what they want to hear. Even on "Millie", the pulse is constantly straight, although I can see why people will say this is wonky with the fuzz bass and the reverse clap sounds. But to me, it seems very straight, structured, but with mixed structures...It just bugs me that no one ever says "I can really hear the metalcore influence in her beats" (NB: Listen out for the drum fills in "Millie" Metal as fuck!) or "she has a good understanding of the half-step"

Q: So that IS something that you want listeners to pick up on, your hardcore influences?

Ikonika: Yeah, well...to an extent. I dont want to have a gimmick but I feel like its not a background that any of the other dubstep producers have so naturally I want to show that side of my musical upbringing. Its something that will make me stand out.

Q: So we are gonna have some Deftones style-vocals in the next joint?

Ikonika: Hahahah! Actually, you might just... I have some samples of Chino's little grunts and mumblings, Ill see if I can work that in! (Grins maniacally)

Q: Excellent. So to conclude, a broad question, which I know you hate. Hah!
That is this: How do you feel about the stereotypes in dubstep, not from a sexist standpoint, but from a musical one?

Ikonika: Well, thats not as broad as the sexism one! I think ravers and people who frequent clubs were the main music is not dubstep but there may be a "dubstep room"; have their own impression of what dubstep is. Is that an accurate one? Probably not, but if someone like Skream is in there, with his way of mixing bangers with more pensive tunes; it should open their minds somewhat. The stereotypes happening now are ones of sub-genres within the music, which I think is a bit stupid at this stage. Its counter-productive, its more likely to cause division at a time where we need unity as a genre.

Q: That's a valid point, so are you worried that it will cause conflict, a 'dubstep civil war' if you will?

Ikonika: There is that chance, but I highly doubt it, there are still so many people with such a passion for making it, DJ'ing it and going out and hearing it. At the moment I only worry about my music being considered good by the dubstep crowd. I was worried about "Millie" because of how much people liked 'Please'. All of a sudden there was this pressure to top what I had done previously, but Kode 9 told me he liked it better than 'Please' and 'Simulacrum' (The B-Side to 'Please') put together! So that was a relief. He also messaged me to say " Dont go thinking you're the next Burial or anything! Even though people are talking like you might be". So, he keeps me in check, helps keep my feet on the ground and my mind focused.

Q: That's is of utmost importance and you are very fortunate to have someone in your corner who is going to keep you in line and keep your brain on your music.
I think that concludes everything I had to ask, and I just want to say thank you for taking the time to do this, because you didn't have to.

Ikonika: Thank you for having me, I enjoyed it.

And there it is, one of the few ladies repping for the dubstep scene; with a very sage view of how things are and a very level-headed approach to her ever-growing reputation and *gasp* fame.
Hope you have enjoyed the information revealed here, it may have given one or two readers some insight they were curious to know. On the other hand, it may have been an extended exercise in futility.
Ive been the nameless interviewer, thank you and goodnight.

"Snaake, snaake eater....EAteerr...oooooh, snake eaaater"